Looking for an anrchist community

topic posted Sun, February 24, 2008 - 11:24 AM by  ferrel1134
i am 27 hitting the road in a little less then 60 days with no plans other them wanting to get out of this dead end bs system i find my self living in i am looking for like minded people that belive dri action is powerful i am looking at heading the the west coast but open to any plans trying to find a community i can join and sahre common engery and goals with
posted by:
ferrel1134
Florida
  • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

    Sun, February 24, 2008 - 1:31 PM
    There are no "anarchist" communities, that is, no communities outside of the rule of the state. Unless you go to South America, deep in the jungles. And they don't want you there.

    Anarchism is about self-responsibility, a character trait you cannot gain from a community. Before you go looking for yourself in others, you must find your self at home. Learn to think, spell, write in complete sentences; read Abbey, Kropotkin, Whitman and Thoreau. Go on long solitary hikes in the wilderness. Search the Nietzschean depths of your soul.

    Then when you've found yourself, community will find you. You'll have something to offer others, not just take from them. Mutual aid.

    Hayduke Blogs
    hayduke2000.blogspot.com/
    • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

      Sun, February 24, 2008 - 1:43 PM
      I disagree. Especially if you are reading Kropotkin, its ALL about the community. If you are reading Nietzsche and Steiner or Goodman then probably not, as its all about the individual.

      There are communities with Anarchistic tendencies. Look for code words like "egalitarian" instead of Anarchist. Pick up a copy of the intentional communities directory.
      • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

        Sun, February 24, 2008 - 1:51 PM
        thanks for your kind words i belive that we can work as a group to build a better world not just look out for our selves humans tend to like to spend time with others not alone the world we are living in wants us alone and powerless not shareing meals and time build projects that help and aid people the world i want to live in someday is selfless not selfish
      • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

        Sun, February 24, 2008 - 1:54 PM
        "Community" is not "a community."

        Community exists right where you live now. If your community is not to your liking, work to bring about change, right where you live.

        Anarchistic tendencies are not anarchy. So-called "egalitarian" communities are not anarchies just because they're egalitarian. They still exist within a coercive society and must deal with the greater society at large.

        Anarchy starts between the ears. It is not intruded from outside. Find anarchy in yourself and bring it to your existing community. How can we change society if we keep walling ourselves off from others?

        hayduke2000.blogspot.com/
        • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

          Sun, February 24, 2008 - 2:15 PM
          "Anarchistic tendencies are not anarchy. "

          I agree.

          "So-called "egalitarian" communities are not anarchies just because they're egalitarian. They still exist within a coercive society and must deal with the greater society at large. "

          Some communities practice small scale Anarchism. Its not the final goal, but its a step up from being an Anarchist alone in an apartment you are paying rent for without much ability to operate anarchistically. Society is based on "agreements". Anarchist society is based on mutual non hierarchical agreements. Without such agreements there is no Anarchist society. Personal Anarchy does not create Anarchist societies. It takes a collective effort.

          "Anarchy starts between the ears. It is not intruded from outside. "

          This contradicts your original statement that Anarchist tendencies are not Anarchy.

          I want to build Anarchist society, both large and small scale. An Anarchist society cannot be built without a social agreement.
          • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

            Mon, February 25, 2008 - 10:31 AM
            I think actually both sides of this debate have some validity.

            On the one hand, it can be horrendously frustrating to feel isolated, alienated by the culture in which one finds oneself living, and just simply wanting OUT without much of a clear idea of alternatives. As one example from my own life, I've never particularly cared for the monetary system, but I don't particularly like the idea of starving or being busted for vagrancy either, so I find myself holding my nose and using a system in which I don't believe. I too would like to find a community whose principles are close to mine so that I can get off what I call the "hampster wheel" and start doing more of what I believe in and less of what I don't believe in and help to support that community. Having a support structure does kind of help.

            On the other hand, I think Hayduke has a good point as well. Anarchy, for me, goes beyond just being pissed at "the system" and thinking "the right community" is going to provide all the answers. If I don't basically have my own shit together--something I'm still working on too--that makes it difficult for me to be an asset to any community, anarchistic or otherwise.

            I try to align my actions with my principles, with varying degrees of success, and it's always a process of learning more about myself and what my options really are. One of the main reasons I joined this tribe is to learn from and share with others.

            Peace,
            --Andy
            • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

              Mon, February 25, 2008 - 11:34 AM
              Joining a community isnt enough to change the larger system. When I get around to helping build a community (After Chinese medicine school-and wilderness paramedic training), I plan on still being connected to the cities or at least the college towns rather than isolating myself. I am a radical environmentalist, but not a primivivist, and plan on keeping on with message blogging and media publications. Urban co-ops is another option for living communally for cheaper, and living some of your principles admittedly small scale. The community I want to be a part of would be just outside of city limits, but close enough for people to come from the city for music events or teach inns, but far enough of the major city roads that we dont have to worry about police patrols looking for reasons to hassle us, or nosy neighbors. I would like to have enough space to live comfortably, but practice democratic control over our local resources and the means of production. I think its good practice.

              I would not want to join a totally secluded community in the middle of nowhere. I would probably get bored, and I would feel like I am ignoring the problems of the outside world when I should be taking action. I want my community to empower me towards action, not distract me from it.
              • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                Mon, February 25, 2008 - 9:10 PM
                Why not take it a step further.

                You already live in community. Be the change you wish to see in the world, right where you live now.

                Anyone can band together with a group of like-minded friends. It's fun, satisfying and... trivial. Try living your ideals in your present community, finding ways to promote and support alternative economic, political and social systems. Support co-ops, free tables, barter networks, squats, shared transportation.

                Give yourself to your community and it becomes an extension of your self.

                You can't change "the larger system." You can change yourself and those you live with.
                • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                  Mon, February 25, 2008 - 9:32 PM
                  "Try living your ideals in your present community"

                  I would, but I would soon go to jail. I could theoretically start digging up the pavement to build community gardens, but people will come and cover it back up with cement. I would abolish rent, but without class uprising its not going to happen. This just isnt an Anarchist neighborhood, even if there are Anarchists here and there. Together we could make something, but only if we share space.

                  "You can't change "the larger system." "

                  Maybe not all by ourselves we cant, but collectively we can and should.
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                    Tue, February 26, 2008 - 10:37 AM
                    I live in a mobile home park, the most densely populated housing arrangement in our bioregion. I grow vegetables and fruit on my tiny plot of cement and asphalt, without digging up a bit of artificial surface.

                    When I first arrived, this park was a model capitalist, central authoritarian social structure, completely at the whim of the park owners. Now the residents own the park as a cooperative and decide for themselves how our community is managed. My wife and I organized our neighbors to make this change, a simple example of supporting and promoting anarchism within an existing community. And the beuty ofit is that the word "anarchy" was never mentioned.

                    Anyone can do it.
                    • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                      Tue, February 26, 2008 - 12:15 PM
                      Good for you. Thats pretty awesome actually.

                      However, the guy is curious and wants to experience something. Why are you trying to rain on his parade? Maybe he wants to see an alternative model and experience something on his own before he goes out to recreate what he likes about it elsewhere, and figure out what he would rather do differently.

                      Its a learning experience and you dont need to be so discouraging.
                      • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                        Tue, February 26, 2008 - 9:00 PM
                        I would hardly call this "raining on anyone's parade." Passing on the fruits of one's experience is called "teaching" where I come from. :>;

                        My original point was: "There are no anarchist communities." This is simply observation. Since there are no communities existing outside of state social systems, there are no anarchist communities at all.

                        Now, if one wants to visit intentional communities to see how others organize themselves, that's something else entirely. I did this extensively in the 70s and 80s and had a great time at it. I came to the conclusion, however, that moving out to another community or starting a new community (with the increased use of precious resources) is unnecessary and counterproductive. One lives in community and can be much more effective working wihin existing social structures.
                        • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                          Tue, February 26, 2008 - 9:07 PM
                          This seems more like a semantic issue. There are communities of anarchist. although there are no places, at least in the US were we have a full fledge anarchism. But there are plenty of places that are anarchist, though it does get subverted by the status quo. I think that is pretty common knowledge among most anarchist.
                          • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                            Wed, February 27, 2008 - 8:52 PM
                            Anarchy means "no state."

                            Where are these places where there is no state?

                            Where are these places where residents are not subject to the laws, and enforcement of the laws, of the state?

                            A cute face mask and a brick does not make one an anarchist.

                            Anarchism is the body of thought concerning the establishment of anarchy, a society without the state. An anarchist is one who opposes the state and works to create a society free of state coercion.

                            Pretending anything else is dishonest and a disservice to anarchism

                            • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                              Wed, February 27, 2008 - 10:44 PM
                              >>>>>>>>>>Anarchy means "no state."

                              Actually, it means no leader, not no state, though inherently there is no state in anarchism. If you were in a place were there is no state but had to work under somebody, then there is no anarchy. In reality no place in the world is totally anarchist.

                              I am under no allusion that a face mask does not make the anarchist. But defining one that opposes the state is a rather incomplete definition of an anarchist.
                    • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                      Tue, February 26, 2008 - 12:34 PM
                      on and off I live on "the mesa" near Taos, NM. Cops and landlords don't exist out here. The roads are too bad for most of the cops, most folks wouldn't call 'em if they would come. Yeah, the make a nominal effort (more effective some years than others) to "raid" peoples greenhouses. Otherwise, we don't see 'em often. No landlords cause the land is so cheap that most folks own their plot. Sure, some folks will rent a house (or something serving the same purpose) to a friend or such-like. Usually a pretty open-ended agreement and terms are pretty loose. Usually, as long as you don't fuck nothing up, do what you want.

                      There was an interesting documentary called "Off the Grid" done about 3 years ago about some of the folks here, the anarchic tendencies, and even a novel conflict resolution with some folk who were actually calling themselves anarchists, spouting proudhon and others in an attempt to justify (one of) their 'compound's' member's thievery.

                      J
                      • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                        Tue, February 26, 2008 - 3:33 PM
                        Proudhon believed that workers are entitled to the product of their own labor, so he would be against theft from the working class or poor, but also believed that the corporate overlords are not the true owners of the land or means of production, and certainly not over the products created. In that sense, an underpaid worker stealing a pair of Niki shoes he made himself with the machinery he or she operates is a form of "liberation", but stealing the groceries of a poor student on food stamps is unjustifiable unless you are on the brink of starvation.
                        • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                          Tue, February 26, 2008 - 9:04 PM
                          Well, Proudhon is dead and not likely to be revived.

                          An underpaid worker stealing a pair of Nikis is a thief and no better than the corporate overlord. One does not become what one seeks to overthrow. Better to organize a free store and provide for everyone, than steal and keep it to oneself.
                          • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                            Tue, February 26, 2008 - 9:07 PM
                            "An underpaid worker stealing a pair of Nikis is a thief and no better than the corporate overlord."

                            I disagree. Those workers are being exploited, sometimes paid less than 1% of the value of their labor, but they work because large corporations corner the markets driving small business out of operation. This is especially true where free trade has opened up in the third world.

                            Even if it is theft, its not an example of theft that bothers me, or one that I would hold against somebody. I certainly dont compare them to corporate overlords. Thats ridiculous.
                            • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                              Tue, February 26, 2008 - 9:17 PM
                              >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Those workers are being exploited, sometimes paid less than 1% of the value of their labor, but they work because large corporations corner the markets driving small business out of operation.

                              Which is a perfect example that things are already stolen, even when everything is legal.
                      • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                        Tue, February 26, 2008 - 3:51 PM
                        >>>>>>>>>>>on and off I live on "the mesa" near Taos, NM

                        Hey didn't Rummy had a sister out there? I once heard about this guy who accidentally got on the FBI's shit list because he got to close to her house.
                        • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                          Wed, February 27, 2008 - 7:22 AM
                          Tue, February 26, 2008 - 3:51 PM, Tedster wrote:

                          >>Hey didn't Rummy had a sister out there?

                          Yeah, I think he had a place out here, too. When he comes to town it's usually a heavy scene. A lot of folks out this way, even the folks who live in town are pretty liberal anyway. People have been arrested for petty stuff during his visits. Nothing I can personally verify, tho.

                          J
                          • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                            Wed, February 27, 2008 - 7:34 AM
                            Oh, and another group of anarchists that may be worth looking into: Rainbow Family of Living Light; the world's largest non-organization of non-members. Yeah, they are a buncha hippies, flakes, drunks, idealists and know-it-alls, but they have been practicing small-scale anarchy (12-35,000 people for one month in a random national forest) once a year for almost 35 years. Not to mention the "regional" gatherings that happen on a much smaller scale (50-5,000 people) around the country, seasonally as weather allows.

                            I saw you post a similar thread over in the Rainbow Family tribe, ferrell1134, with mixed results. I didn't have the answer you were looking for there, nor do I here and now, but once you hit the road, things usually start falling together as they should.

                            J
  • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

    Tue, February 26, 2008 - 5:27 PM
    There's a difference between an undeveloped mind running away from their personal problems, and someone who's looking for like minded people to grow with. If you can find those people in you area that's great, but sometimes it's just not possible, and I know how alone that can make one feel. I am hitting the road sometime between now and the end of may, i'd like to head west. I want to connect with people, set up a squat and get a community going. You sound like you'd be interested if so, we should combine our energies.
    • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

      Tue, February 26, 2008 - 6:17 PM
      If your interested in squatting, I can show you some cool places in Santa Santa Cruz.
      • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

        Wed, February 27, 2008 - 8:45 AM
        never thought about santa cruz being cool to squat in i am down to find as many like minded people to join forces and set up something lol
        • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

          Wed, February 27, 2008 - 11:55 AM
          Santa Cruz has a lot of forests walking distance from down town that you can hide and set up camp in.
          • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

            Wed, February 27, 2008 - 6:20 PM
            is greyhound rock still cool to kick it?

            and if ya like humboldt there's places to squat all over there.

            isn't there an anarchists "convention" at xavier in Ohio? not according to their calendar, however.


            J
          • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

            Wed, February 27, 2008 - 8:46 PM
            Yes, especially when it rains for a week with 50 mile per hour winds!

            I've been to those forests and helped clean up squat camps filled with needles, beer bottles and human shit. If you squat, clean up after yourself!

            I suspect Sentience doesn't live in the forest. There's a lot of late model cars parked around the Chinese medicine offices.
            • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

              Wed, February 27, 2008 - 9:11 PM
              I spent 2 years living in the forest. I had a home out there and I took care of the place.

              The forests here are nice. I do agree though that you should respect the land when you visit. Dont leave trash or other garbage around. Do be careful around other peoples squats. It is in fact possible to get pricked by a used needle. I have only seen a few in my many years of exploring, but it can happen....Then again, I didnt really hang out near the train tracks. I was back in a nicer part of the woods.
              • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                Wed, February 27, 2008 - 10:58 PM
                We dont really get high wings around here either.
                • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                  Thu, February 28, 2008 - 8:06 AM
                  Then you weren't outside in the last two winter storms.

                  Anarchism is about personal responsibility. In my experience, many squats and camps in the woods exhibit a lack of personal responsibility. Wind or no wind.
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                    Thu, February 28, 2008 - 4:10 PM
                    Many people living in cities exhibit a severe lack of personal responsibility. The major difference is that their impact is cleanly swept away into landfills and into our air and drinking water. Overall, even the obnoxious drunk punks (Who are not really anarchists) have a lower environmental impact that your average condo city dweller, even if they do make a mess out of their squat. Im going to make any excuses for them. However, its just as bad when people dump their trash when they dont sleep outside as it is when they do. It pisses me off when people dump their garbage off the side of the road.

                    For your information, I have lived outdoors through severe weather. The weather is not that bad in Santa Cruz, but it can get rainy in the winter. I made it through 2 months of nearly solid rain. We had the nice set up though.....awesome military tarps. Tent up on a platform off the ground. Stove. 1 outhouse we made, plus a nearby restroom walking distance. It was a pretty sweet set up. Eventually we got evicted, but I loved it while it lasted.

                    The trees buffer the winds anyway. Its not nearly as bad as you are making it sound.


                    If you are a drunk punk though who disrespects the earth, the eco-anarchists who live in the woods and actually care about the place might give you a hard time.
                    • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                      Fri, February 29, 2008 - 6:11 AM
                      my life is based on how i can better myself in order to help the world that set up sounds really really pretty and peaceful unllike living in modren cities or condos where life is spent stuck in a box watching a box eating out of a box driving in a box lol. i like the sounds of less eco damage in that life vr the life most people are living now people dont care or think about how much eco damage there doing because it goes away out there door and hide somewhere and in the end it will blow up in there faces after its too late to change anything about it. i belive the time is now or never the clock is ticking and its going fast and its sad to see what un awakend people are doing. thats why i belive its time to drop out and help as many people awaken as quickly as possable before this system nose dives and takes the whole planet with it.
                      ferrel
                      • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                        Fri, February 29, 2008 - 6:38 AM
                        "...stuck in a box watching a box eating out of a box driving in a box..."

                        Sorry if this is a bit off-topic, but that sounds like a great line for a song.

                        "i like the sounds of less eco damage in that life vr the life most people are living now people dont care or think about how much eco damage there doing because it goes away out there door and hide somewhere and in the end it will blow up in there faces after its too late to change anything about it. i belive the time is now or never the clock is ticking and its going fast and its sad to see what un awakend people are doing. thats why i belive its time to drop out and help as many people awaken as quickly as possable before this system nose dives and takes the whole planet with it. "

                        Sometimes, though, people in cities do care. I live in a suburb of DC, and I try to do what I can (i.e. when I see trash on the ground I put it in the nearest garbage can or dumpster), I recycle as much as I can, and about 99% of my furniture is dumpster scores. I couldn't drive even if I wanted to because of my visual impairment--and for several reasons, I don't think I would often do it even if I could--but this is a mixed blessing. Sure, I may walk instead of drive, but that also means I can't necessarily get to a recycling center as much as I'd like (I have to rely on my apartment complex to haul away my recyclables); I have to do my grocery shopping where I can instead of going to a more eco-friendly/organic place; for some things I can dumpster-dive (like furniture, as I said), but as far as finding food there I have to be careful because I could end up simply not seeing if I got bad food. One reason that I've also considered living in an anarchist community of some kind is because I realize fully that I often end up compromising my principles and I feel bad about that.

                        Peace,
                        --Andy
                        • tod
                          tod
                          offline 3

                          Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                          Fri, February 29, 2008 - 2:27 PM
                          this seems like insanity......
                          why the fuck does anyone care.
                          anarchy does live within the heart, but why not share your life with people who are like minded free thinkers!
                          im not talking about a revolution,
                          im talking about survival!,
                          we cant change the world!
                          but we can band together and try to be happy!
                          this seems a hell of a lot better than revising your trailerpark community...
                          • Re: Looking for an anrchist community

                            Fri, February 29, 2008 - 2:34 PM
                            Yeah, starting a free box in the trailer park doesnt seem as appealing to me either when compared to building an Anarchist community from the ground up.
                            • Re: Looking for an anarchist community

                              Fri, February 29, 2008 - 2:58 PM
                              How do you think you "start" an "anarchist" community? Wave a magic wand and repeat an incantation?

                              Community consists of relationships among individual humans. These relationships are expressed in various ways. Wherever people are gathered together, the relationships among them are always under negotiation.

                              If you can't build non-coercive relationships among members of existing communities, you will never build a new community from scratch based on non-coercion.

                              No matter where you go, there you are!

                              Furthermore, building a community from scratch requires exploitation of more and more natural resources. We no longer have that luxury.

                              "Be the change you wish to see in the world." Mahandis K. Gandhi